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	<title>Comments on: Scenes from a revolution</title>
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	<link>http://tbogg.firedoglake.com/2008/11/15/scenes-from-a-revolution/</link>
	<description>&#34;...a somewhat popular blogger&#34;</description>
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		<title>By: unclemike</title>
		<link>http://tbogg.firedoglake.com/2008/11/15/scenes-from-a-revolution/comment-page-1/#comment-22012</link>
		<dc:creator>unclemike</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 16 Nov 2008 17:45:03 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://tbogg.firedoglake.com/2008/11/15/scenes-from-a-revolution/#comment-22012</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;Except that California has very specific legislative rules for amending the Constitution.  The courts have to decide if this proposition falls under the “amendment” category, or the “addendum” one.&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;The SC of CA still has a say in the matter.&lt;/p&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Except that California has very specific legislative rules for amending the Constitution.  The courts have to decide if this proposition falls under the “amendment” category, or the “addendum” one.</p>
<p>The SC of CA still has a say in the matter.</p>
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		<title>By: pluege</title>
		<link>http://tbogg.firedoglake.com/2008/11/15/scenes-from-a-revolution/comment-page-1/#comment-22000</link>
		<dc:creator>pluege</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 16 Nov 2008 16:07:47 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://tbogg.firedoglake.com/2008/11/15/scenes-from-a-revolution/#comment-22000</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;Agreed. I think this is the only viable approach. while I can appreciate the need for venting via public protests, I don’t see any near term quick fix…just keep on pushing until its won.&lt;/p&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Agreed. I think this is the only viable approach. while I can appreciate the need for venting via public protests, I don’t see any near term quick fix…just keep on pushing until its won.</p>
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		<title>By: mirele</title>
		<link>http://tbogg.firedoglake.com/2008/11/15/scenes-from-a-revolution/comment-page-1/#comment-21999</link>
		<dc:creator>mirele</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 16 Nov 2008 16:04:36 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://tbogg.firedoglake.com/2008/11/15/scenes-from-a-revolution/#comment-21999</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;So you bring it back every two years until it passes.&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;I think that’s appropriate. Push it in their faces every two years. Make them run an apocalyptic, end of the world campaign every two years. Tap them out. &lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;Then we win.&lt;/p&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>So you bring it back every two years until it passes.</p>
<p>I think that’s appropriate. Push it in their faces every two years. Make them run an apocalyptic, end of the world campaign every two years. Tap them out. </p>
<p>Then we win.</p>
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		<title>By: Kassandra</title>
		<link>http://tbogg.firedoglake.com/2008/11/15/scenes-from-a-revolution/comment-page-1/#comment-21993</link>
		<dc:creator>Kassandra</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 16 Nov 2008 15:31:17 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://tbogg.firedoglake.com/2008/11/15/scenes-from-a-revolution/#comment-21993</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;Agreed.It’s at the bottom of the problem.&lt;/p&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Agreed.It’s at the bottom of the problem.</p>
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		<title>By: Kassandra</title>
		<link>http://tbogg.firedoglake.com/2008/11/15/scenes-from-a-revolution/comment-page-1/#comment-21991</link>
		<dc:creator>Kassandra</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 16 Nov 2008 15:30:34 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://tbogg.firedoglake.com/2008/11/15/scenes-from-a-revolution/#comment-21991</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;Frankly, I’m surprised MSM is even showing these protests; they never showed the war protests. I wonder what’s going on?&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;I always thought MSM broadcast the illegal immigrant protest hoping to get riots going….but, I’m probably paranoid after all these years&lt;/p&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Frankly, I’m surprised MSM is even showing these protests; they never showed the war protests. I wonder what’s going on?</p>
<p>I always thought MSM broadcast the illegal immigrant protest hoping to get riots going….but, I’m probably paranoid after all these years</p>
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		<title>By: pluege</title>
		<link>http://tbogg.firedoglake.com/2008/11/15/scenes-from-a-revolution/comment-page-1/#comment-21989</link>
		<dc:creator>pluege</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 16 Nov 2008 15:27:33 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://tbogg.firedoglake.com/2008/11/15/scenes-from-a-revolution/#comment-21989</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;Progressives should be working to get the tax exempt status removed of any and all religious organizations that get involved in politics and political actions, because that is expressly illegal.&lt;/p&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Progressives should be working to get the tax exempt status removed of any and all religious organizations that get involved in politics and political actions, because that is expressly illegal.</p>
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		<title>By: pluege</title>
		<link>http://tbogg.firedoglake.com/2008/11/15/scenes-from-a-revolution/comment-page-1/#comment-21988</link>
		<dc:creator>pluege</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 16 Nov 2008 15:24:46 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://tbogg.firedoglake.com/2008/11/15/scenes-from-a-revolution/#comment-21988</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;&lt;em&gt;This is not going to go away.&lt;/em&gt;&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;unless the courts are willing to strike down the proposition as unconstitutional, which I don’t know if its even possible and highly doubt they would if it is, there is nothing anyone is going to do about prop hate in California except be angry about it. The voters voted it in. This is supposed to be a democracy and the voters word should be supreme (unlike New York City where rich daddy Bloomberg is managing to blatantly thwart the voters will.) &lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;I would think that it would take another proposition supported by the voters to over turn it. I would think that is the ONLY thing progressives would be supporting because progressives strongly support democracy. Progressives should not be looking to manipulate the system because they don’t like the outcome - that’s what republicans/conservatives do.&lt;/p&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><em>This is not going to go away.</em></p>
<p>unless the courts are willing to strike down the proposition as unconstitutional, which I don’t know if its even possible and highly doubt they would if it is, there is nothing anyone is going to do about prop hate in California except be angry about it. The voters voted it in. This is supposed to be a democracy and the voters word should be supreme (unlike New York City where rich daddy Bloomberg is managing to blatantly thwart the voters will.) </p>
<p>I would think that it would take another proposition supported by the voters to over turn it. I would think that is the ONLY thing progressives would be supporting because progressives strongly support democracy. Progressives should not be looking to manipulate the system because they don’t like the outcome &#8211; that’s what republicans/conservatives do.</p>
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		<title>By: shootthatarrow</title>
		<link>http://tbogg.firedoglake.com/2008/11/15/scenes-from-a-revolution/comment-page-1/#comment-21982</link>
		<dc:creator>shootthatarrow</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 16 Nov 2008 14:35:55 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://tbogg.firedoglake.com/2008/11/15/scenes-from-a-revolution/#comment-21982</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;The zealotry both Mormons and Roman Catholics chose to run with regarding Prop 8 in California was/is not founded on better Americanism. Surely was not based on better instincts of tolerance and enlightened co-existence.&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;Zealotry is a tempting weapon. But it does have blowback downsides. As seen in the photo above. Prop 8 was viewed by some as a means to stop what some did not support or consider correct. This zealotry of action however has not put a stop to the matter of equality at hand. It has started a greater drive and desire to not be treaded upon by those who out of fear,ignorance or intolerance sought/seek to impose a values/beliefs set on others. This being a dangerous place to go for all Americans. Doors get opened/closed that once opened/closed bring on unforseen outcomes and consequences. The Mormons and Roman Catholics now in the midst of finding this to be so.&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt; My ‘church’ takes a dim view of Mormonism and Roman Catholicism but that does not entitle me to go out and outlaw Mormons and Roman Catholics does it? I think not. Of course my ‘church’ also takes a dim view of gays.&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;Centuries of acquired and held thoughts and beliefs going into this. The force of tradition is powerful here. But also very flawed and wrong. The fight is against this entrenched tradition. Tradition will lose. As it did with human slavery,womens rights and stupidly held race concepts.&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;Anti-gay traditions are based much more on hoary old European political and social control thoughts/methods than anything to do with what Christ and his Middle Eastern based religion had to say about being gay. &lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;Hopefully the Mormons and Roman Catholics will come around to seeing they are trying to hold back what will not be held back. Otherwise they risk becoming ridiculous agents of intolerance and very irrelevant to 21st century American social justice,equality and the pursuit of liberty.&lt;/p&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The zealotry both Mormons and Roman Catholics chose to run with regarding Prop 8 in California was/is not founded on better Americanism. Surely was not based on better instincts of tolerance and enlightened co-existence.</p>
<p>Zealotry is a tempting weapon. But it does have blowback downsides. As seen in the photo above. Prop 8 was viewed by some as a means to stop what some did not support or consider correct. This zealotry of action however has not put a stop to the matter of equality at hand. It has started a greater drive and desire to not be treaded upon by those who out of fear,ignorance or intolerance sought/seek to impose a values/beliefs set on others. This being a dangerous place to go for all Americans. Doors get opened/closed that once opened/closed bring on unforseen outcomes and consequences. The Mormons and Roman Catholics now in the midst of finding this to be so.</p>
<p> My ‘church’ takes a dim view of Mormonism and Roman Catholicism but that does not entitle me to go out and outlaw Mormons and Roman Catholics does it? I think not. Of course my ‘church’ also takes a dim view of gays.</p>
<p>Centuries of acquired and held thoughts and beliefs going into this. The force of tradition is powerful here. But also very flawed and wrong. The fight is against this entrenched tradition. Tradition will lose. As it did with human slavery,womens rights and stupidly held race concepts.</p>
<p>Anti-gay traditions are based much more on hoary old European political and social control thoughts/methods than anything to do with what Christ and his Middle Eastern based religion had to say about being gay. </p>
<p>Hopefully the Mormons and Roman Catholics will come around to seeing they are trying to hold back what will not be held back. Otherwise they risk becoming ridiculous agents of intolerance and very irrelevant to 21st century American social justice,equality and the pursuit of liberty.</p>
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		<title>By: Cellar47</title>
		<link>http://tbogg.firedoglake.com/2008/11/15/scenes-from-a-revolution/comment-page-1/#comment-21980</link>
		<dc:creator>Cellar47</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 16 Nov 2008 13:38:42 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://tbogg.firedoglake.com/2008/11/15/scenes-from-a-revolution/#comment-21980</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;&lt;a href=&quot;http://www.towleroad.com/2008/11/california-palm.html#comments&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;Here are some great pictures of the demos nationwide!&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><a href="http://www.towleroad.com/2008/11/california-palm.html#comments" rel="nofollow">Here are some great pictures of the demos nationwide!</a></p>
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		<title>By: Cellar47</title>
		<link>http://tbogg.firedoglake.com/2008/11/15/scenes-from-a-revolution/comment-page-1/#comment-21979</link>
		<dc:creator>Cellar47</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 16 Nov 2008 13:34:31 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://tbogg.firedoglake.com/2008/11/15/scenes-from-a-revolution/#comment-21979</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;Not only is this “not going away,” it’s ust getting started. I was in Los Angeles demo from about 9:30 am well into the afternoon. Speaking as a 61 year-old gay activist(I joined New York’s GAA right after Stonewall) I can proudly say I fell30 years younger. These kids are teriffic. Smart, committed,angr and gorgeous. They’ve been out from the nanosecond they realized they were gay. They’ve all got boyfriends and grilfriends are having the time of their lives fighting injustice.&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;There was a news report the other day abotu out enemies - somehwere behind the Orange Curtain — moaning about the fact that we haven’t curled up like leaves in Autumn and blown away. They really thought they had the uper hand and had “stopped” &lt;em&gt;Teh Ghey&lt;/em&gt; in its tracks.&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;&lt;strong&gt;AS IF!!!!&lt;/strong&gt;&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;And on that note — &lt;a href=&quot;http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RQ3IyCa8bG4&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;TAKE IT AWAY IRVING!!!&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Not only is this “not going away,” it’s ust getting started. I was in Los Angeles demo from about 9:30 am well into the afternoon. Speaking as a 61 year-old gay activist(I joined New York’s GAA right after Stonewall) I can proudly say I fell30 years younger. These kids are teriffic. Smart, committed,angr and gorgeous. They’ve been out from the nanosecond they realized they were gay. They’ve all got boyfriends and grilfriends are having the time of their lives fighting injustice.</p>
<p>There was a news report the other day abotu out enemies &#8211; somehwere behind the Orange Curtain — moaning about the fact that we haven’t curled up like leaves in Autumn and blown away. They really thought they had the uper hand and had “stopped” <em>Teh Ghey</em> in its tracks.</p>
<p><strong>AS IF!!!!</strong></p>
<p>And on that note — <a href="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RQ3IyCa8bG4" rel="nofollow">TAKE IT AWAY IRVING!!!</a></p>
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