Comments on: More bad apples bad apple-ing

By: vbuyol123

vbuyol123 — Tue, 09 Jun 2009 17:39:46 +0000

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By: lexalexander

lexalexander — Fri, 29 May 2009 19:55:30 +0000

Faces (and other identifying characteristics) of victims can be obscured before release. The perps’ faces, OTOH, should be as clearly visible as possible, the better to prosecute.

By: godistwaddle

godistwaddle — Fri, 29 May 2009 10:47:21 +0000

As a veteran (1964-67), I think I can say that most young soldiers are rubes who wanna be thugs. Service training obliges them. These thugs, however, DON’T usually do thuggish things unless authority either explicitly orders it or turns a blind eye. England and Graner do time, and Bush and Cheney remain unhanged. Where’s the justice?

By: PacificCoastRon

PacificCoastRon — Fri, 29 May 2009 06:23:58 +0000

It also makes even huger amounts of sense from a geopolitics point of view of not having 250 million Arabs and up to a billion other Muslims even more mad at us, or at least dis-inclined to favor us, than before.

By: soonergrunt

soonergrunt — Fri, 29 May 2009 03:19:44 +0000

I have lived a Soldier’s life these twenty-one years.
I have never done, nor allowed anything like a war crime.
My first Platoon Sergeant told me in Panama that I needed to stay alive, watch out for my buddies, and never do anything that my mother would be ashamed of discussing at church.
I love the Army and I love my soldiers.
I don’t feel that my own personal honor has been compromised by Abu Ghraib or the lies that led us into this disaster, but I know that some people question my honor because of the actions of some of my brethren.
I do personally know the dark places that one’s soul can go without discipline and the support of strong leaders. I’ve never done anything that I would be ashamed of, or anything that is a crime, but that is as much because I had somebody sit me down and make me think about things as it is any part of my character.
The people who committed these heinous crimes and the people who suborned them should spend the rest of their lives in prison. I’m not one of those people. Neither are any of my soldiers, nor anyone that I know.
Get and be as angry about this as you need to. Write letters, march the streets, and whatever else you feel compelled to do, and more power to you.
Please remember in your anger, righteous as it is, that the vast majority of us are absolutely innocent men and women who have tried to do a very difficult job under dangerous circumstances because that’s what our elected leaders demanded of us.

By: brandane

brandane — Fri, 29 May 2009 02:24:29 +0000

Obama looks like Bush the third.

By: kgb999

kgb999 — Fri, 29 May 2009 01:03:53 +0000

The Taguba report came out in 2004, the interpreter rape thing seems pretty well documented (BTW:moondancer@13 The Sy Hersh article link was the basis for that TPM diary you are talking about). 90% of what the Telegraph said wasn’t actually new. They kind of blended incidents from the report with the genuinely new statement that there were specifically photos showing rape and other horrendous acts (a congresswoman also mentioned this back when they were shown the all the materials at the onset of the scandal).

I think Taguba is talking about the entire “Iraq torture collection” which consists of some 2000 photos and videos and such. There is clearly some bad stuff in there. Obama and the pentagon are talking about a set of photos involved in the ACLU lawsuit (I think it’s 2 batches of 20-odd photos each). Within that specific subset, there is nothing more upsetting than Abu Ghraib and everyone involved has been punished. There is no reason Taguba would know exactly which 50 are involved in the lawsuit. You just gotta speak “Washington” in order to see how both statements can be true.

I don’t know the details of the ACLU case, but I’m guessing they knew to ask for the specific photos for some reason (mentioned in a hearing/trial?). The whole thing is a red herring - there is nothing immediately involved that could possibly endanger our troops. I can’t shake the feeling this is to cover for McChrystal, who seems to have overseen much (if not most) of the abuse in Iraq. He had a whole different line of authority and set of brutal authorizations than Gitmo (although they were also clearly based in Yoo’s malpractice).

One thing is for certain, a full accounting is the only thing that will answer the rumors once and for all. At this point, Al Queada can pretty much say we did ANYTHING and are just covering it up with the abusers walking free. Everyone will believe them no questions asked - hell even our allies. IMO, this issue will put our troops at greater risk and undermine Obama’s administration until it is resolved.

By: JGabriel

JGabriel — Fri, 29 May 2009 00:53:49 +0000

pseudonymousinnc @ 23:

If you look at the accounts of people shipped off to Guantanamo, a common theme is that their captors seemed to enjoy sticking objects in their anuses …

All while screaming, “It’s Giuliani Time!” Or am I the only one who remembers the right turning that into a call of action, rather than the symbol of shame that it is?

By: JGabriel

JGabriel — Fri, 29 May 2009 00:50:31 +0000

If these photos include rape and sexual abuse, then Obama’s reluctance to release them makes much more sense, at least from a “respecting the privacy of the victims” point of view.

By: SmileySam

SmileySam — Fri, 29 May 2009 00:10:27 +0000

The already released photos had at least 2 photos of Sexual Abuse, so while maybe straining the point, Pres. Obama may have be correct when saying we had already seen like photos.

The photos can be viewed, Graphic Warning, http://www.atlargely.com/atlar.....-rape.html