Reading Susan’s post here, I was reminded of my grandfather. Grandpa gave most of his advice with his actions, but he once told me, “Don’t marry a man who is mean to the waitress.”
Grandpa was bit of a flirt with the wait staff. Didn’t matter if we were just going out for $2 burgers, he always acted like they’d made his day by bringing him his food. They’d come by, ask how things were, and he’d always say the same thing: “The quality of the food was only exceeded by the charming service.” Sometimes they’d give him a look like maybe he was messing with them, but then the toughest chain-smoking tight-permed truck-stop-counter hardass would have to smile, because this five-foot-ten elderly fellow with soda-bottle glasses and big thick hearing aids and ears like a cab going down the street with the doors open would be grinning the most infectious grin you ever saw on a human being and there’s no way he was having them on. He meant it. And he always left them something extra, too.
That advice he gave wasn’t exactly what we always hear, right? It’s usually “marry a man who’s nice to his mother.” But plenty of assholes are nice to their mothers. Serial killers are nice to their mothers. Grandpa’s point was that the true test of someone’s decency is how he treats those who he could abuse with impunity if he so chose. The waitress depends on you for her livelihood, for her job, and lots of people with power issues find it easy to take them out on people like that. You’ve all seen it, in stores or in restaurants or in your jobs: Somebody picking on the weaker person just because they can.
Somebody who has to remind the help that they’re the help will, sooner or later, treat everybody in his life that way. Somebody who needs to kick those beneath him to prove he’s a big man, publicly and unnecessarily, will eventually do that to you, once you become inconvenient. Somebody with creepy power issues and problems with his manhood is not somebody who needs a girlfriend, and sending a steak back four times and then berating the person who brings it in front of his or her manager is a pretty big flashing light that says RUN RUN RUN.
For what it’s worth, I followed Grandpa’s advice. He and Mr. A got on famously from the minute they met until the day Grandpa died, and I must have passed along his words a hundred times.
What’s the best relationship advice you’ve ever gotten?
A.



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Word.
My uncle used to say the exact thing in different words – the day you think your servant is beneath you is the day you lose your character.
When we were younger (I grew up in a country where it was routine to have servants to clean the house), we used to clean the house ourselves (I mean get on your hands and knees and mop up that floor with a wet towel – all six rooms in the house) when the servant had the day off.
It built character and I have never regretted it.
No one ever gave me that advice, but they never needed to, anyway.
I went out with this guy (ONE time) back when I was in college – we went out to dinner, and when the waitress brought the change back from the tab, he went into this big production (not to the waitress but to me) about how she had obviously given him 5 ones as change instead of a five as a pointed suggestion about the tip – so he was going to “show her” by only leaving her a buck.
I was absolutely appalled, first of all by his stinginess and meanness, secondly because he seemed to be under the impression that letting me in on what he was doing would impress me.
Like I said, ONE time. He called several times after that asking me out but I never wanted anything to do with him after that.
Good for your grandpa, he sounds like a great guy. If he was of my folks’ generation (born early 20th century), he had plenty of opportunity to experience the downside of free market economics. That generally gave you an empathy for working people, whatever your other politics (my dad hated FDR but always tipped big).
Lemme guess: College Republican or gliberatarian?
Nice. Useful, also.
The best relationship advice I ever got – ‘Marriage is an endless series of compromises.’
And here’s a great line from a eulogy given by the departed’s partner in an episode of ‘Six Feet Under’ – “It wasn’t always easy. It wasn’t always fun. But it was always worth it.”
I was recently in an argument with someone who wrote to my social group that “he [that's me] addresses people [that's him] in a manner I reserve for errant waiters and hotel clerks.”
Your honor, the state rests.
One of my aunts used to say that if you never have fights/disagreements, one of you is a doormat, i.e., that it’s to be expected that you’re going to have disagreements.
And I don’t remember any particular advice my parents gave me, but I do remember, back when I was in my early teens, they must have been going through some kind of rough patch (I have no idea what about), and weren’t talking much for a few days/weeks, but, despite that, every morning my dad would give my mom a kiss goodbye before he left for work, same as always. The message I took from that was that they had a sense their relationship would endure, even if they were really pissed at each other right then. They just celebrated their 54th anniversary, so they must have done something right.
The other thing I took from their relationship is a basic, enduring respect for each other.
I have always considered it helpful to get plenty of ones in change for the tip. But then I’m not an asshole (I hope).
Like Steve Buscemi’s Mr. Pink in Reservoir Dogs.
Thanks, Dad. “Never take yourself too seriously, and never trust anyone that does.” That piece of advice got me into the right relationship and got me out of two of the wrong ones.
Best relationship advice I found out for myself. You don’t just put the seat down you put down the lid too. No need for petty arguments and both of you have to work.
Ok, so that’s not as eloquent as Mrs A. (I smiled myself when I read your description of your grandfather) and maybe not world shattering but I like it.
This is a good line to remind yourself from time to time: “Everything is easier to get into than out of”.
As an old retired gangater, I tip heavy. Real heavy, even if the service is substandard, I tip well. Good relationship advice from my father- “If you’re not working together, you’re working against each other.” First marriage, not so good. This one, fanatastic. I don’t need to “run” things, anymore. I like the assistance of a full partner.
I always found that paying attention to how the other treats waitstaff is a huge clue to their personality, even if they only ignore them. The other advice is how they treat animals. If a person is brutal to animals…run!
I like your grandfather’s advice, and it’s so true. I would never go out with someone more than once who treats any kind of serving staff poorly. As for the best relationship I’ve ever gotten–it was from my best friend. She told me, “Any past relationship is a failed relationship by definition because you’re no longer in it.” Her point was, everyone has the bad relationships until they are in the one that works for them.
I always tip well. In real dollar terms, the difference between a good tip and a shitty tip is so small anyway, at least at the restaurants I go to. My first wife got all upset with me once because I “tip so much”; I didn’t have a calculator, so I busted out pen and paper and did the long division to show that the difference between a rock-bottom 15% tip and what I had left was less than $3. She didn’t like that.
I don’t know whether this counts as advice; it’s more of a baleful warning. But the mom of an ex of mine, who was married four times, once said “You never really know someone until you divorce them.”
After 2 failed relationships, disastrously so, I underwent therapy to make sure I didn’t make the same mistake thrice. Have been VERY happily single in the 25 years since.
Having been a waitress, I agree with Grandpa.
Two pieces of advice I’ve always remembered. One from an old roommate who came back from a disastrous date and moaned, “All I ask is that someone be able to keep up their end of conversation.” It sounds simplistic, but if they can’t talk, it usually means they don’t think either.
And from my mom on my scary first day at college. She laughed, “You’re a freshman forever.” She was right.
Asking me about good relationship advice is like asking Squeaky Fromme how to successfully assassinate the president… I think I’ll sit this one out. :-)
I found this out for myself…I wondered why this nice pharmacist was so dull, and realized when at his house for dinner, I didn’t see one book, anywhere. That didn’t last long.
a person who abuses those who are weaker , is called a bully
I have been intuitively able to handle bullies, who I have encountered in biz situations, not in personal life. If you just stand up to them, they have a tendency to crumble. I’m sure not all are like that, but I’ve had a couple of them who big males have feared against, whilst I, a small female, stood up to. Worked for me. In fact, Leon Cooperman, my boss’s boss accused me of bullying him. I took it as a high complement, and I didn’t do anything other than point out that his ‘investment’ in Berkshire Hathaway was nothing more than the equivalent of a mutual fund. That was about 1985, and I assure you, Leon was shocked at my analogy. He actually thought BH was a corp, not a mutual fund.
a person who abuses those who are weaker, is called
a bullyRethuglican
Rush Limbaugh
Glenn Beck
Rupert Murdoch
Roger Ailes
and….
It’s gotta be a psychological thing.
Just observation, but I’ve seen that people who are truly generous are never bullies, and people who are bullies are never truly generous.
How people get to one or another of those states mystifies me. But it seems to me that the relationships I’ve seen where each partner is truly generous with each other works out great.
Took a bunch of relationships before I found Mr. B.
The one thing I always maintained though, was that I got into a given relationship for a reason, and since it takes two to play, there was no way I was gonna bash the other one for the relationship not working out.
As a result, I have cordial relationships with all the ex’s except one. Pretty happy with that.
Who can stand up to the Wall Street bullies?
I’ve found that not all bullies crumble when you stand up to them. The right wing bullies will sue you, defame you and attack you.
And when they are actually hurt by someone who successfully attacks them they also whine. They are quick to show how they are the real victim.
A woman who used to work for me asked Mrs. S what attracted her to me. “Was it because he is so funny?” She said, “Actually it was his kindness.”
Well, there’s a difference between bullies and “pit bulls.”
Pit bulls (the human type) are just savage, and yep, once hurt will whine and lick their wounds. And to the savage types, I say “no mercy.”
Fab Tourre should be in prison.
One of the reasons that many people don’t find the right wing’s “sense of humor” funny is because it is often people in power attacking people with less power.
My granduncle, who also happened to be the priest at my wedding said, “Never go to bed angry. If it takes all night, resolve it.”
It works.
Also my grandmother never learned to drive and my wife is the same way. My grandfather tried to teach her once an it was the only subject you could never bring up with either of my grandparents. His advice to me was to pay for lessons and left it at that. I’ve kept my word.
Two thoughts.
1. Republicans do not have a sense of humor. They have a mean streak, that they think is the same thing.
2. My father said that when pople are backed into a corner, they will fight. Especially when you are winning the argument, always offer the other guy an easy way out.
What a sweet story. Thanks for this Athanae. Being kind is great advice.
My grandmother, who died eight years ago at the age of 101 and three months, used to say “Never marry a woman whose toothbrush you wouldn’t use.”
–
“Don’t marry a girl with an Adam’s Apple and testicles.” My grandpa once told me that when he saw me chatting with Ann Coulter at a street fair in Greenwich Village.
My grandma told me: Always wear a rubber.
And get a restraining order, stat. Cruelty to animals is just practice.
This is just me, and a personal um benchmark . . . if you can’t/don’t trust their driving (a car or boat), you can’t trust them at all. This is probably more related to the treatment of wait staff than is apparent: if they don’t care about expensive machinery, their own lives, or your life – seek another. Another personal benchmark . . . if you don’t have at least 3 musicians/composers, 3 artists, three poets, 3 authors, 3 scriptwriters/playwrights, and 3 friends in common, you don’t have enough in common at all. This leads to some conservatism in personal relationships, but hey, after lust, you gotta have something.
I’m not sure if it counts as relationship advice, but when I was in 7th grade, my mom gave me the following insight into men’s behavior, and it proved 100% true:
Oh, I’ve got one – this was my advice to a friend’s 21-year-old daughter who was in a relationship with a loser: any man who would rather sit up late & drink alone rather than going to bed with you is not a man you want.
“How does your intended partner treat you when you’re sick?” is a good indicator. If they’ll stick with you when you are at your worst; throwing up, dirty hair, ugly cough and fever, then they are a keeper. If they cook for you, get you some Nyquil in the middle of the night, and hold your germy hand, they’re a keeper.
If they leave the house and go hang out with friends or do anything to stay away from you, lose them. Because “in sickness and in health” isn’t just a line in your vows, it’s real life. One or the other or both of you will get sick at some point. Maybe it’s the flu and maybe it’s cancer. So pick the partner who will be there for you.
I see people mistreating McDonald’s workers frequently. Makes me ill. Oh, and it’s not just men as your piece implies. Women bully these decent folk as frequently as men.
This is a very fine post. I would mention, in passing, that the advice is actually gender neutral. I’ve seen a lot of women browbeat waitresses.
The advice my dad gave me, the day I got married, was, “Don’t say things you don’t mean.”
After 47 years of marriage, I think my own advice has to do with valuing the relationship more than any other, so that neither partner cheapens it by gossip with other parties.
Pearls from my mom, who was also my high school English teacher:
1. “All work is honorable work, even digging ditches, and nothing’s beneath you,” followed by, “If you want an allowance, go scrub the toilet.”
2. “Everybody’s smart about something,” followed by, “Yes, you can conjugate a verb, but you don’t know how to fix your car, so be nice to the mechanic.”
Especially when you are winning the argument, always offer the other guy an easy way out.
Sounds like classic Sun Tzu! ;)
Athenae, your grandfather sounds a lot like my dad. Some of his best friends are people who waited on him at some point; one of which has pretty much become family. As for advice, I can’t add a lot to what has been said. I’ve always (well, almost) had excellent relationships because I’ve always treated my partner with respect. The almost came from the one time I didn’t.
Best relationship advice: “stop drinking”
My father said, “you made your bed, now sleep in it”. Now I can proudly say that I am still married to the same woman for over 37 years. We have both made mistakes, but we still stand together with trust and love.
Sure, I’ll bite.
My mom had a teacher once who told her class, “There’s no such thing as a perfect love.” I believe that. Love is hard f**ing work. But then again, so is pretty much everything else work doing.
No matter how pretty she is or how handsome he is, somebody somewhere is tired of their shit. I have never found an exception. Ain’t love grand.
I agree about the sickness comment so much. My ex was a drama queen when she got a cold, but at least I tried to help.
When I was recovering from surgery and lying in bed, she would bang drawers to show she was inconvenienced by not having me doing things.
My own rule is to be genuinely glad to see one another and show it. That often unspoken show of affection can do so much to lift the day.
My grandfather’s advice:
There’s nothing wrong about sleeping with someone you’re not married to. It’s staying awake that gets you into trouble!
The advice I’ll give my nieces and nephews when they’re a bit older:
What counts in making a happy marriage is not so much how compatible you are, but how you deal with incompatibility.
- Leo Tolstoy
After working in family support, my advice to my son and his friends (of both sexes) was don’t sleep with someone if you wouldn’t want them raising your child. Not only for the child’s sake, but if you wouldn’t want them in your own life for 18 years to forever.
Marriage is mostly conversation. — Nietzsche
I won’t compare myself to Squeaky Fromme, but I probably shouldn’t be offering advice.
Regarding waiters, I’ve had some bad ones. Usually I’ve assumed they’re having a bad day, but that’s no reason for me and my friends to be treated poorly. I give a reasonable tip, based on service. Good waiters get good tips.
And I like the Tolstoy quote. That applies to more than just marriage, and is good advice for Obama re currying Republican votes.
Re: “Any past relationship is a failed relationship by definition because you’re no longer in it.”
I think it’s good to loosen up a little on the notion of “failed”. What is the real goal of a relationship anyway that lets you measure success or failure? Is it possible that as long as both parties experience intimacy and have some learning experiences that you’ve still succeeded in some way? Is the only definition of success being the one where you are with the same person until one of you dies?
I imagine that is how most people measure success in a marriage. It’s right there in the vow “Till death do us part”. I can’t think of much else in life that measures its success only by dying. Marriage really is an institution. I know because I escaped from one once and am still on the lam!
When asked how he felt about failing thousands of times in his search to find the right filament for the electric lightbulb, Thomas Edison replied: I have not failed, not once. I’ve discovered ten thousand ways that don’t work.
In the end, I suspect that happiness in a relationship is all about managing expectations, primarily your own.
Well, I would say that a ‘failed’ relationship is one that ends because you no longer want to be with that person in that way or vice-versa. So, Edison’s change from failed to didn’t work is apt. I can’t speak to marriage because I have never been married and have never wanted to be married, partly for the very reason you mentioned. I cannot imagine being with one person for the rest of my life.
“A person who is nice to you but rude to the waiter, is not a nice person”
(Dave) Barry’s first law.
Tommy
I sure would have like to have met your Grandpa, Athenae.
In honor of my late stepfather, I’ll repeat his advice about getting along with fellow humans: You should try to treat people so as to bring out the best in them.
That was the way he put it, almost like a scientific theorem. He was a rather shy man, intelligent and cultivated, who came from a difficult family and Depression-era poverty, working his way into engineering college on scholarship and a very creative technical career.
We didn’t always get on well – there was a basic difference in mental and emotional style, I think. Plus the inevitable issues that crop up when a man with no experience of little girls marries a widow with a 7-year-old daughter who is not only manifestly another man’s child but has been oddly spoiled all her life by fond grandparents. But he was a man of great mental range, social consciousness and integrity, and although he unwittingly stood in my way with his rather Old World ideas about gender roles, in many important ways I owe him a lot. And miss him.
Find someone who can live without you.
Something my Grandmother said often. “The measure of a man is not by how much he has, but by how much it takes to make him angry.”
My advice: Avoid those who massage their self-esteem in public.
Mother Avenger’s advice was almost brutal:
“Remember, it’s not enough that you fuck them, you have to be able to talk to them afterwards.”
If it’s not good enough to kiss, don’t stick anything in it.
My mother told me never to trust anyone who refers to him/herself in the third person.
Avoid romantic relationships with people who don’t like cats. It’s been my observation that most people who dislike cats are control freaks.
Don’t hang around people that make a bunch of excuses for themselves, and you can easily see the difference between excuses and reasons.
And waitstaff? Three things that the wait staff can be held accountable for. If they give you the wrong order, if the food’s cold when you get it, if it’s not busy, and they just don’t get around to you. Everything else might easily not be their fault.
My mother warned me that I should avoid Jewish men because all they thought about was sex. I followed the opposite of her advice and it’s all worked out quite well.
my wife is very good to the waitstaff. she’s a bitch to me, though. kind of shoots holes in grampa’s theory, don’t it?