Mitt Romney’s War On Mitt Romney’s life continues apace:
…Romney, now 65, was of draft age during Vietnam, his military background — or, rather, his lack of one — is facing new scrutiny as he courts veterans and makes his case to the nation to be commander in chief. He’s also intensified his criticism lately of Obama’s plans to scale back the nation’s military commitments abroad, suggesting that Romney would pursue an aggressive foreign policy as president that could involve U.S. troops.
[...]
As a presidential candidate in 2007, Romney told The Boston Globe he was frustrated, as a Mormon missionary, not to be fighting alongside his countrymen.
“I was supportive of my country,” Romney said. “I longed in many respects to actually be in Vietnam and be representing our country there, and in some ways it was frustrating not to feel like I was there as part of the troops that were fighting in Vietnam.”
Indeed, Romney strongly supported the war at first. As a freshman at Stanford University, he protested anti-war activists. In one photo, he’s shown in a small crowd of students, smiling broadly, wearing a sport jacket and holding up a sign that says, “Speak Out, Don’t Sit In.”
But the frustration he recalled in 2007 does not match a sentiment he shared as a Massachusetts Senate candidate in 1994, when he told The Boston Herald, “I was not planning on signing up for the military.”
“It was not my desire to go off and serve in Vietnam, but nor did I take any actions to remove myself from the pool of young men who were eligible for the draft,” Romney told the newspaper.
But that’s exactly what Romney did, according Selective Service records. He received his first deferment for “activity in study” in October 1965 while at Stanford.
[...]
After his first year at Stanford, Romney qualified for 4-D deferment status as “a minister of religion or divinity student.” It was a status he would hold from July 1966 until February 1969, a period he largely spent in France working as a Mormon missionary
[...]
His 31-month religious deferment expired in early 1969. And Romney received an academic studies deferment for much of the next two years. He became available for military service at the end of 1970 when his deferments ran out and he could have been drafted. But by that time, America was beginning to slice its troop levels, and Romney’s relatively high lottery number — 300 out of 365 — was not called.
The Times also notes:
Critics note that the candidate is among three generations of Romneys — including his father, former Michigan Gov. George Romney, and five sons — who were of military age during armed conflicts but did not serve.
Time to dust off the ol’ Five Brothers Blogging files, and pull this one out about his 5 Strapping Young Sons:
(Boston Herald) Gov. Mitt Romney, who has comforted the grieving loved ones of soldiers killed in Iraq and promoted National Guard recruitment, yesterday said he has not urged his own sons to enlist – and isn’t sure whether they would.
The Herald posed the question as Romney – a potential 2008 White House contender and backer of President Bush’s Iraq policy – was honored by the Massachusetts National Guard after he signed a bill extending pay for state workers on active duty.
“No, I have not urged my own children to enlist. I don’t know the status of my childrens’ potentially enlisting in the Guard and Reserve,” Romney said, his voice tinged with anger.
Massachusetts residents can enlist in the National Guard up to age 39. Romney’s five sons range in age from 24 to 35. Neither the Romney children nor the governor have served in the military, Romney spokeswoman Julie Teer said.
As I pointed out in my original Five Not For Fighting post, what the Romney boys really enjoy is trust funds and, as it was written, so it was done:
Mitt Romney’s five sons — Matt, Tagg, Craig, Ben and Josh — are sitting pretty with a trust fund worth $100 million.
Getting there took investments that produced great growth, according to the Romney campaign. It also took smart tax strategies.
Romney and his wife Ann have been giving to the boys since 1995, and, according to a spokesperson for the Romney campaign, all of their contributions have been below gift-tax contribution limits.
The limit for a couple in 1995 was $20,000 and has since grown to $26,000. In addition, there’s a “lifetime gift-tax exclusion” for all the boys that totaled $1.2 million back in 1995 and has since grown to $10 million.
Add it all up, and the Romneys could have gifted $1.3 million in 1995, and a total of $10.6 million through 2011. All tax free.
To sum up, the Romney family have done a stellar job of avoiding both military service in the wars that they support as well as paying any taxes that might pay for said wars. So, when Mitt Romney says:
“Greatness in a people, I believe, is measured by the extent to which they will give themselves to something bigger than themselves,” Romney said in San Diego last week to a Memorial Day crowd of thousands, flush with military veterans of all ages.
…what he really means is: War is for poors. You bought it … you fight in it.





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But-but… SOLYNDRA!!!
damn a whole flock of chickenhawks …
This is a Public Service Announcement. For anyone who is not familiar with the original Five Not For Fighting post, do not hesitate to click the link. Go read what the inestimable Mr Charles Pierce has called “the funniest thing in the history of the Intertoobz.” You will not regret it. This has been a Public Service Announcement.
‘suggesting that Romney would pursue an aggressive foreign policy as president that could involve U.S. troops.’
Greatest sad of my generation. The chickenhawks always, ALWAYS turn around and try to prove that they really were Good Soldiers, after all. It’s not enough that Vietnam was the worst, most ungodly awful, stupidest ‘war’ in all of US history, destroying both those who were there and those who were not, the entire generation hurt and maimed, and every single woman whose natural companions were those who served and those who did not – but thirty years, forty years later, the chickenhawks show up and try to prove something – mostly by killing people who never did them or this country any harm at all.
Pfui. I hates them, preciouss. I hates them.
If the Rmoney campaign doesn’t want to talk about their candidate’s leadership at Bain except in the most general way, and would rather not focus on Mitt’s governorship in Massachusetts, I can’t imagine this military-service topic is Team Rmoney-approved.
Please try to stick to approved Rmoney topics in future, humble blogger.
So Romney put his religion before his country. Someone needs to ask him why we should believe he would be any different as President.
Yeah, that’s going to happen.
Well, the same could be said for obama. There was Greneda and Gulf War 1 that bo could have enlisted in.
Alas as you said, another chickenhawk who in this case loves offin’ anyone he can with drones. Yes, the small dick inmates are running the asylum!
This is really lovely…even Cheney was honest enough to say he was doing other things…iirc. Of course, W learned to fly a plane, almost.
Right, he could have enlisted for the war in Grenada … which lasted what — 36 hours? He could have signed up, done the 5-minute version of basic training, and shipped out in time to storm the beach (and still been back for the weekend!).
While I might agree with you, ask yourself how long those wars lasted and if anyone knew they were coming. I think it is a very unfair comparison.
Forgot that war in grenada was quick. Would have been perfect for bo. He’d have been back quick enough to get back to his golf game.
But when the tax man comes to the door …
No, it couldn’t ‘be said’ about President Obama. And the fact that you have deliberately misread what I said, which was specific to Vietnam, tells me that you are trolling. Leave me out, Jack. I’m not a part of your game. Also? Spelling isn’t optional.
Well, we’re operating on hindsight especially for gulf war 1. Who would have thought we’d be in Afghanistan for 10 years back in 2002.
Obama is supposed get into his Birth certificate planting time machine and join up don’t ya know.
Then do it again 10 years later.
I did. Every educated person in this country did. Back off.
Chuy, lay off. Go play in the street.
trolling? so if this is such a wonderful critique of mittens, why wouldn’t bo pursue it? Ya really think the repubs wouldn’t be asking the same of bo?
It’ll be like the mistake of attacking mittens on his treatment of the dog only to have repubs mention obama said he ate dogs.
You gotta think these things through!
By the way, I do think obama sucks.
Really?
I remember those days. I sincerely believe Romney is lying but I don’t know which part of the lie is biggest.
I had no trouble getting draft deferment renewals as long as I stayed in school, which was handy because I did oppose the war. Did not especially want to go to Canada either. After that I got employment deferments by teaching in a public school serving U.S.Army dependents. Jesus, how I hated that. By the time I ran out of excuses for deferment, I drew Number 1 in the lottery, Sept.14th. But I was one year too old! They only took adolescents who have no sense of being an independent person with a self will. Adolescents can be trained to obey without any problem.
There is NO fucking way that the scenario Romney projects for himself is true. He WANTED to go fight, war is great, but God held him back? Yeah, right. It is so insulting to be called stupid enough to believe such shit.
Well, at least I know there was a bigger asshole than me. You are so right and I may have been chickenshit but a lying chicken hawk IS worse.
By the way, I do think obama sucks.
Of course you do and you’ve certainly impressed us all with your cognitive abilities…
Yes.
It was a terrible, terrible time for all of us, those who went and those who stayed. It was an impermissible ‘war’ and it was something that no sane person wanted anything to do with. Those who had to do with it – for whatever good or bad reasons – they broke afterwards.
I stayed home. I cleaned up afterwards. I’m still cleaning up, those 55 and 60 and 65 yo’s who never did heal, who brought their brokenness to the table and tried to carry on. To see Mittens play the card that ‘he would have served’ makes me actually nauseated. I knew too many boys who didn’t have the privilege of vacationing in France.
I think we can probably conclude that the time when the head of state has had experiences in life largely relegated to the poor (such as conscription or enlistment) is long over.
Thank you (sarcasm ignored).
Yah you sound like you find a great deal of things easy to ignore.
I think family is clearly off limits. But, just out of curiosity, I wonder if those gifts are taxable as income for each of the kids or were they put into trusts which somehow avoid taxation. It would certainly be wrong for the rich to be able to hide away income from taxation by merely putting it in a trust for the kids. The poor certainly can’t afford to do anything like that.
The tradition of service in the Mormon church is long-standing and shouldn’t be challenged. If Mitt says he wanted to serve in the war and couldn’t I believe him. It doesn’t change a lot about who he is and what he stands for today. I mean, after all, we already knew he was rich and a Republican, so his support of the Vietnam war shouldn’t be a surprise to anyone.
That past should be left alone. It doesn’t serve our nation to rehash it over and over. We have far more important things today to face and respond to.
Don’t be absurd. Neither of those engagements lasted long enough for anybody to enlist, complete basic training, complete tech, A, C schools, (depending on service branch), and then serve in combat or even a support role. Persian Gulf 1 lasted weeks, Grenada lasted a few days, American involvement in Vietnam started as an advisory capacity in 1950, then escalated to ground troops in 1961 and maintained a strong presence until the Case-Church Amendment passed in August of 1973. The situations aren’t remotely analogous.
The past cannot be left alone. There must always be some people minding it, thinking about it, studying it fairly, incorporating it into the present and advising the future with it.
Of course, I’m an historian. I kinda gotta think this is so. I try not to be a pest about it.
I don’t. But YMMV.
Just trying to bring you into the real world. Part of the problem obama and his ‘bots have is they operate in an echo chamber. They just refuse to listen to advice outside their little circle. They just can’t handle criticism. Thus people like Booker who provide constructive criticism is smacked down.
It’s because I don’t ignore the rest of the world outside team bo I provide my criticism.
Noblesse Oblige has “officially” been replaced with “I got mine, Fuck You.”
And when I say Fuck You, I mean those who tilted the playing field to ensure no more Horatio Algers and those who fluff them – like Psalongo.
Again, operating with the benefit of hindsight. Also as I said, why isn’t bo using this? Perahps even he realizes the next question would be, why didn’t he enlist in the military regarless of whether we were at war or not?
Again absurd. I was there. There was little doubt as to how long it would last once begun and the outcome was never at issue. Actually I met somebody later who joined the Army early in Operation Desert Shield, (always thought those cutesy names were stupid), in order to serve in the Persian Gulf War. I was back in the US, separated and employed as a transmission mechanic by the time he finished his training. With W’s invasion, everybody knew it was going to be a long term commitment or they did if they listened to the wanking chimp who made no secret that he wanted that oil.
The past of a presidential candidate cannot be left alone. What if he is wife-beater, abuses his children, is a pedophile, etc? Maybe he/she drinks too much. The voters have a right to know what these candidates are like. I want to know everything about any person I vote for.
See my comment @ 32. I’m not defending Obama, you know better than that. I have as much use for him as I do head lice but let’s stick to real criticisms, rather than throwing shit against a wall to see what sticks. Just my .02.
I never met anyone who believed we would be in Afghanistan 10 years, longer than we’ve been in WWII.
Have to disagree here. IMHO, Booker is a bought-and-paid for, backstabbing asshole. But reasonable folks can disagree on this, I am sure.
Great review…thanks…esp how it just kept creeping….
First you demand Obama should have been part of the invasion of Grenada and then you claim you’re just trying to bring “Obots into the Real World”.
I say again, impressive cognitive abilities…
Well isn’t bo bought and paid for by the same types people!
Sorry. I wasn’t addressing Afghanistan but if we were to do so, I know a great many people who argued just that. Not the “10 year” number exactly but Afghanistan is notoriously bad for empires. In the Navy during the 1980s, we used to laugh at the Soviet Union for getting bogged down there.
You don’t get out much, do you?
Yeah…people don’t realize how far back that history goes. It started when Vietnam was still French Indochina!
Screw this. I am sickened by the baby trolls. This one is no different from the one the other day – Krisann? – who decided that everyone over (NAME UR AGE LIMIT) had only evil in their hearts.
Pfui.
Isn’t this a post about R, his service, etc. Just a thought.
Thanks…I was really just coming of age, the language changed, and we were Knee deep in the big muddy….Tore generations apart. Same thing now is happening, I guess, but more in the political sphere.
No rich person or their children will ever fight in a war again. Why would they – they will leave that to the servants.
You’re being defensive here. How will this “fortunate son” strategy benefit obama?
I’m not demanding he enlist in the military. I’m merely pointing out that if he critiques mittens on his lack of service, that question will be asked of him. In fact to follow up on that he will be asked if he will encourage Sasha and Malia to enlist.
Your love for bo clouds logical stategy, especially knowing republicans.
Sorry for the digression but it seemed like a bit of context was necessary.
I used to think the draft would come back for reasons of justice; now it will only come back for the “end times”, holocaust…..imho. Still unjust.
Not meant for you…that context is very important and informs any discussion of Viet Nam….What was it? Advisors? Yeh….
True. I guess where I’m coming from is what do you do with this. While interesting I don’t see this as a winning campaign issue.
If it gets that bad the rich will retire to some far distant place and live happily ever after – with our money.
I’m just saying, sure Obama could have joined but you can’t use wartime as a cudgel. Willard could have joined anywhere between the ages of 18 and 26 to serve in Vietnam, Obama would have had to join between August 2, 1990, (when Hussein invaded Kuwait) and February 28, 1991, when the surrender took place, (the fighting lasted from January 17 to the end of February), and he would have been 30 years old. It’s not at all clear he could have joined at that age. They were being pretty picky back then. I had to get 3 waivers in 1985 when I was 25!
You’re really that stupid?
Here’s to hoping you never make it inside that little circle…
Here’s the deal, Paul. I could ask people to ignore you since you’re obviously trolling here like a child asking “why .. why… why” even though you don’t give you a shit what the answer is and you keep moving the goalposts in the little game in your head. Or I could just nuke all of your comments.
This may be on the main page, but it’s my blog. So, knock it off, or death from above.
Ok, fair enough. Let’s just say military service then, which would be the main point.
Isn’t O much younger than Rom? I do not connect him to the VietNam era at all, and nothing has produced the conflict and ire of VietNam. Had Rom been a poor kid, he could not have avoided it. Had he really wanted to serve, his scruples would not have stood in the way. I had a good friend who was a CO and ended up with stateside service. Rom is as many colors here as he is on other issues, like health care.
Some folks are born made to wave the flag
Ooh, they’re red, white and blue
And when the band plays “Hail to the Chief”
Oh, they point the cannon at you, Lord
It ain’t me, it ain’t me
I ain’t no Senator’s son
It ain’t me, it ain’t me
I ain’t no fortunate one, no
Some folks are born silver spoon in hand
Lord, don’t they help themselves, oh
But when the tax men come to the door
Lord, the house look a like a rummage sale, yes
It ain’t me, it ain’t me
I ain’t no millionaire’s son, no, no
It ain’t me, it ain’t me
I ain’t no fortunate one, no
Yeah, some folks inherit star spangled eyes
Ooh, they send you down to war, Lord
And when you ask them, “How much should we give?”
Oh, they only answer, more, more, more, yoh
It ain’t me, it ain’t me
I ain’t no military son
It ain’t me, it ain’t me
I ain’t no fortunate one
It ain’t me, it ain’t me
I ain’t no fortunate one, no, no, no
It ain’t me, it ain’t me
I ain’t no fortunate son, no, no
John Fogarty
You offer up “Obama sucks” but then we hear you explain how concerned you are for his campaign and saving delusional Obots?
Impressive cognitive abilities…
Not so much defensiveness as you sounded like you wanted to make an ass of yourself and I thought I’d offer a little help.
OK, I’ll take my toys and go back to the rest of FDL. Ta ta.
Very nice. thanks.
If you read the article from above you’ll see that Obama was in elementary school during Vietnam. Romney, depending on the interview, said he “longed to be in Vietnam” and then he didn’t want to serve.
That is the point here.
I dunno. It’s hard to look at a gift of $10 million each to 5 young, well-educated men as anything but a vote of no-confidence, that they don’t have what it takes to earn their own pile. This is your aristocracy, America: cherish it…
Thank you. You’re welcome to stay, but not if you’re just here to bait people in order to get attention.
Gee shucks TBogg, can’t we play with it for a little while longer?
Huh? Huh? PleEEEEEZZZZ?
You never let us have any fun.
Barack Obama having not served is a fair point to consider but since the thrust of this post seems to be about Willard’s less than truthful statements and his continued acrobatics position wise, I don’t understand the relevance of bringing up Obama’s lack of service. To the best of my knowledge Obama has never lied about his reasons for not joining.
Just because it followed you home, doesn’t mean you can keep it. That’s how we ended up with Harold Ford.
Front row, 1971, Des Moines IA. Stoned.
You have to cut Mitt some slack – he doesn’t know why he didn’t serve. Dumbest man I’ve ever seen. :)
That’s because it’s a diversion.
Play?
I was setting up to view “death from above”!
Goddammit, Tuesday is Death from Above Day in the old Mickey Mouse Land Show, Wednesday is Anything Can Happen Day…
Im sure he cannot keep it all straight….Thanks
Hell, he doesn’t know why he left Seamus on the roof…
Sorrry.
Yeah. who’s Seamus?;) Sorry.
Is Cheney heading up Mitten’s VP search campaign by any chance?
So he can get another term…found the best guy again. And liked collecting all that confidential information, as I recall.
Seamus was the dog Willard tied to the roof of his car and then drove to Canada with. Oddly, the dog ran away shortly after that. Just goes to show you that your average Irish Setter is brighter than your average Republican voter.
OT- Venus is about half away across!
http://apod.nasa.gov/apod/astropix.html
Refresh to update. There is a link to a livestream there too.
Science, Bitches! Get some!
And the dog was quoted as saying:
I’ll bet it turns out he got a deferment…and a new home with Humane people.
The thing you guys (from both sides) need to understand is that Vietnam was the last war – outside of those on the African continent that are horrific in ways we’ll never understand and we won’t participate in until they have some resource we need – where people died in VERY large numbers.
You saw Iraq I and Iraq II and Afghanistan and Drone Wars and you cannot imagine the slaughter of Vietnam. Of dozens of KIA soldiers wrapped in shelter halfs and poncho liners and hundreds of NVA kids torn to bits by Arty and Air. Outside of Faluja, the industrial scale killing has been taken out of the war, and now it’s just a year or more of stress and tension on a scale the rest of us can’t imagine.
In Vietnam we went on operations. In Iraq they lived in combat every day for a year. That’s toxic. That’s poison. War is evolving, but it’s not getting any better. Do you want to sit in a hole under Illum rounds all night, fighting for your life, or live in a combat zone every minute for a year?
It’s all crazy – and nobody seems to have figured out that the outcome is always the same…
Remember when Dubya promised no “Street to Street” fighting?
Rose petals and oil to pay for it all.
Of course now that the bill is due, Conservatives try to weasel out of that too.
Wow! Someone concern trolling, who can’t even get the simplest game going right. I can’t wait to see what other well-thought out arguments you leave, like so many rabbit-turds in a petting zoo.
I particularly love the “no one I knew” thought the war in Afghanistan would be long & drawn out! I mean, it’s not like there isn’t some historical record of invasions in that region.
Chewbacca is not an ewok, Your existence/argument is invalid.
Very nice.
Word is Seamus booked immediately after being freed from that roof and was last seen headed North at top speed, never to be seen again by the RomneyBots.
You got that right
-Samuel Fuller
The Big Red One
That’s the friggin problem. Nobody did ANY thinking. Of any kind, except the war profiteers and waterboarders.
Here’s the distinction that I think you’re missing. Back in the late 60′s, men of Mitt Romney’s age were being drafted. They went to Vietnam whether they wanted to or not. It was their duty. It was the law. Mitt Romney exploited loopholes in that law in order to avoid that solemn duty, including using his connections within the Mormon Church. He spent three years living it up in a mansion in the south of France, while other men of his age went off to die in French Indochina. He cheer-leaded the war from sidelines while young men who didn’t have the means to dodge the draft did the actual dying.
By the time Barack Obama was old enough to enlist, the draft had long been abandoned. For better or worse, it was then, as it is now, no longer the duty of young men to fight in America’s wars. Enlistment has become a choice. Unlike Mitt Romney during the Vietnam War who was in his early twenties, Obama would have been thirty going on thirty-one during the time of the Gulf War. The choice to go to war at that age is far more difficult than it is at twenty or twenty-one. I don’t know and you don’t know and perhaps even Barack Obama himself doesn’t know whether he would have dodged the draft like Mitt did had it still been in effect in the 80′s.
I think it’s pretty clear that Mitt Romney believes that it was not his place nor the place of his sons to fight in America’s wars. That obligation belongs to lesser men; brave, but expendable. The Romneys’ place is to cheer-lead at opportune times and then to ignore.
Screwy htlm formatting
I’m also interested to see a lot of gas-bags suddenly showing up here, all quiveringly eager to display their ideological purity. Seems that veterans who have no problem supporting troops in the field, while not willing to put up with shitbag purist chicken hawks, while at the same time supporting unions and progressive domestic policies do not exist!
A bit of surprise to me and my fellow veterans, who all also happen to be fairly active in politics (GOTV, donating time, money) and veterans issues and active duty troop support (adopt-a-platoon, etc.) – must be imaginary phantoms according to these all-too-well connected pundits/activists/sainted ones.
Even more so, these are the same idiots who go after Jon Stewart for not being a better journalist.
Looks like you’ve checked out now but seriously, his GOLF GAME?? I don’t know you well enough to know that you’re not a right wing sock puppet but that crap sure does echo that clap trap. Shove it up your ass for me, kay?
Lost a lot of friends and HS classmates in that war, couldn’t talk about it or see a movie about it for years and years. About time to quit making being a warhawk some kind of purity test if you’re a leader. Obama didn’t get us into Iraq or Afghanistan. He’s working our way out of this shit. He’s improved our diplomatic relations with many of our traditional adversaries. I’m not seeing Rmoney as having any great diplomatic skills and anyone who thinks their dog loves riding on the top of the car has got a ways to go in getting the *concept* of *humanity*.
5 sons, 0 daughters… sparks up the old calculator… the chances of that happening are 1 in 32. Could there have been sex-selection abortions in the Romney family? Is it irresponsible to speculate? It would irresponsible not to.
I never believed the supposedly wise people who run this country would be stupid enough to invade Iraq without any kind of plan for running the place afterwards, either. Oops. Actually, I wouldn’t have believed those same people were stupid enough to want to invade Iraq in the first place if I hadn’t read Michael Ledeen’s infamous comment…
Every ten years or so, the United States needs to pick up some small crappy little country and throw it against the wall, just to show the world we mean business.
Well, there you go. Every so often we simply must show the world that we have (and are) bigger dicks than anybody else, and screw the civilians who get in the way, not to mention the poor grunts who inevitably get stuck with the shitty end of the stick. Otherwise people won’t respect us and will get uppity, meaning they might decide that our oil which they happen to live on top of is actually theirs and/or worse yet sign an exclusive agreement to sell it to the Chinese, and we certainly can’t have that.
Pretty much defines the world according to Bloody Bill Kristol, among other neocons who are always eager to see bloodshed as long as it’s somebody else’s blood.
Okay, yeah, there’s one glaring exception. W was fully stupid enough to want to do it so he could be a wartime preznit.
These good folks who protested ‘the endless war’ did. So, just STFU about ‘whodathunk’.
Thanks. The day the cruise missiles were launched, I was at our local Town Clock, protesting. It just seemed a good idea to go there. So did quite a few of my friends, and acquaintances and strangers. I am proud of that. And yes, the word “quagmire” was used, and the experience of the Russians and British (especially) was cited. We were a minority, but we were right.
Obama’s Afghanistan policy was something I disagreed with strongly in 2008, and I still think he was wrong, but I voted for him anyway (considering the alternative), and he does finally seem to be trying to wind down U.S. involvement.
I was in Afghanistan several times in the 1970s. I loved the people. Tough bastards, and if you disrespected them you might get killed; but if you didn’t, they’d treat you right. Words to live by, actually.
In response to the moron who wondered why President Obama did not serve in the first Gulf War.
I did (1st Marines) and at that time the maximum enlistment age was 28, so moot fucking point, also no draft dipshit.
Romney deserves to get his patrician ass handed to him on this because he waxes nostalgic about wanting to serve and how he loves him the military but when actually given the chance to line someone up in iron sights he instead spent it eating baguettes and wondering why the French girls did not like him.
“…what he really means is: War is for poors. You bought it … you fight in it.”
Pretty simple.
The tradition of service in the Mormon church is long-standing and shouldn’t be challenged.
Bullshite, it can be challenged like any other fantasy belief system.
If Rmoney had the guts to say he thought being a missionary was more important than Vietnam because he is religious, then fair enough.
But to suckup to the chickenhawk warmongers by puffing his chest and claiming that he really wanted to be a combat soldier, but some demonic force not only prevented him from volunteering but compelled him to apply for draft deferments (maybe it was Bill Ayers), is weaselly beyond belief.
This morning I am sure that people learn the wrong lessons by looking at the big picture and seeing nothing.
So instead of learning that you need a tangible dangerous enemy for a war. That we do not want to waste our people on wars of political ideology and corporate security. We get people who didn’t want to fight but now don’t want to appear cowardly so are willing to go in with drones blazing for Ideologue and Oil Company alike.
Instead of learning that we need to demand that corporations and governments need to meet their contracts with their employees and treat them as valued, we get people willing to tell those employees to fuck my taxes won’t go for that and too stupid to notice that far more of their tax dollars and their public treasures are being shoveled to corporations that give little or nothing in return and that they have supply more and more of those tax dollars because politicians are telling their big donors ‘taxes are for the little people’.
Apparently people are not going to learn until some of their come home in a body bag, some come home broken to a slashed and cut VA, and the rest are working in a locked sweatshop that burns to the ground. And I don’t
think I have the stomach to stand in the rubble of their life and mine and say “I told you so” any longer.
Actually, I think Tuesday was “Guest Star” Day for the original Mousekeeters…anyone?
Trust are not a way to avoid INCOME tax. The tax brackets for a trust are narrow and you will be taxed at 35% for all ordinary income over $11,350.
You avoid this by distributing the income to the beneficiaries and they pay tax at their individual rate.
If your Mitt’s kids, you’re probably paying the capital gains tax rate anyway.
Trusts are used to avoid Estate taxes. You give away assets early in your life, and that way when you die 20 years later, the asset with 20 years of appreciation is not included in your estate.
Rmoney is a lousy liar. JMHO, of course. Carry on.
Well, see, there’s your problem right there. Rmoney is walking the fine line of “being religious” without being too in yer face about “being Mormon religious”*.
* Funny how this ‘not bein’ in yer face’ thing doesn’t apply to those fucking white shirt/tie/bicycle drones who come to my door and want to convert me to their cult. Why they’d think any woman would want to sign up for the particular brand of crap they are peddling is just another adventure in Stockholm Syndrome-land.
“I was supportive of my country,” Romney said. “I longed in many respects to actually be in Vietnam and be representing our country there, and in some ways it was frustrating not to feel like I was there as part of the troops that were fighting in Vietnam.”
I was in the Air Force from 1965 to 1969 and met a lot of liberal Democrats (like myself) in the days when the liberals were considered “internationalists” and supporters of the Truman Doctrine. I went to graduate school after 1969 and was surrounded by people opposed to the war and part of the “new left.” I never heard anyone, one either side, say that they “longed to be in “Vietnam”, even among those who volunteered for second tours. And no one who believed in their position did so “in many ways” or “in some respects.” The people I knew would have walked away in disgust at anyone voicing those pathetically insincere terms.
His being Mormon had nothing to do with his deferment. Correct me if I’m wrong, but I don’t recall poor Mormons getting deferments to complete their Missionary work during the Vietnam War.
If that were the case, then the Mormon Church would have seen a spike in their “New Convert” stat’s and fewer people would have had to flee to Canada.
Also, per the article above Romney’s deferment was for being either a Seminary Student (since when has Stanford been a Mormon Seminary) or for being a member of the Mormon Clergy. Does the Mormon Church consider their missionaries to be part of the Church hierarchy?
Like all good Chickenhawks, he paid/lied/pulled strings for special consideration that he didn’t deserve, end of story.
I’m betting the fact that the people who are calling the shots “phone it in” may have something to do with it.