Since I am going to be out this afternoon, here is a link to the Rebecca Solnit column that is chapping the delicate buttocks of the Anarcho-Syndicalist Giant Street Puppets Purity Pixie Party.
Excerpt:
One manifestation of this indiscriminate biliousness is the statement that gets aired every four years: that in presidential elections we are asked to choose the lesser of two evils. Now, this is not an analysis or an insight; it is a cliché, and a very tired one, and it often comes in the same package as the insistence that there is no difference between the candidates. You can reframe it, however, by saying: we get a choice, and not choosing at all can be tantamount in its consequences to choosing the greater of two evils.
But having marriage rights or discrimination protection or access to health care is not the lesser of two evils. If I vote for a Democrat, I do so in the hopes that fewer people will suffer, not in the belief that that option will eliminate suffering or bring us to anywhere near my goals or represent my values perfectly. Yet people are willing to use this “evils” slogan to wrap up all the infinite complexity of the fate of the Earth and everything living on it and throw it away.
I don’t love electoral politics, particularly the national variety. I generally find such elections depressing and look for real hope to the people-powered movements around the globe and subtler social and imaginative shifts toward more compassion and more creativity. Still, every four years we are asked if we want to have our foot trod upon or sawed off at the ankle without anesthetic. The usual reply on the left is that there’s no difference between the two experiences and they prefer that Che Guevara give them a spa pedicure. Now, the Che pedicure is not actually one of the available options, though surely in heaven we will all have our toenails painted camo green by El Jefe.
Before that transpires, there’s something to be said for actually examining the differences. In some cases not choosing the trod foot may bring us all closer to that unbearable amputation. Or maybe it’s that the people in question won’t be the ones to suffer, because their finances, health care, educational access, and so forth are not at stake.
An undocumented immigrant writes me, “The Democratic Party is not our friend: it is the only party we can negotiate with.” Or as a Nevada activist friend put it, “Oh my God, go be sanctimonious in California and don’t vote or whatever, but those bitching radicals are basically suppressing the vote in states where it matters.”
Presidential electoral politics is as riddled with corporate money and lobbyists as a long-dead dog with maggots, and deeply mired in the manure of the status quo — and everyone knows it. (So stop those news bulletins, please.) People who told me back in 2000 that there was no difference between Bush and Gore never got back to me afterward.
Argue amongst yourselves. I’m sure that, by the time I get back, you will have all have agreed to form an informal committee tasked with coming up with a framework for a non-binding proposal, subject to approval by two thirds of the voters (with special weighting being given to votes of vegans), that will be used to create another committee which will make suggestions on how best to acquire organically-grown hemp paper and cruelty-free ink on which will be written, by yet a third committee, a gender-neutral manifesto stating in no uncertain terms that Shit Is Fucked Up And Bullshit, but in less sexually threatening and patriarchal language while also being respectful of all other languages that are as equally beautiful and valid as colonialist/imperialist English.
I’ll be back about 3PM so you guys better get crackin’….





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Sounds like we need a good community organizer.
Does El Jefe count? Because I could use a pedicure, also too.
Love the nym; are you in fact one (or all) of The Bobs, or a fan of their work?
Whenever I encounter somebody who complains about the fact that the Democrats are a centrist party (and they are, who are we kidding here?) so what’s the point of voting for them, I ask them to answer the following question honestly: do you think we would have invaded Iraq in 2003 if Al Gore had been president? It’s a very simple question and we all know the answer. Fuck no. This exercise can be repeated for many of the Bush administration’s odious policies.
“Hunh. Is that a bear over there?”
“I dunno, let’s go poke it with a stick.”
“Good plan!”
Could we have another basset picture to hold us over?
Tired and tiresome.
When you go in for the Che Guevara pedicure, also be sure to try the Carlos Marighella Brazilian Wax.
It goes without saying, but I’m gonna fuckin’ say it:
Your absence this afternoon is certainly great news for John McCain!
@ReidMoore, Bravo! Well played, Sir.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qHDdqubE7zQ
While our denzen of the bog is off at the GA shareholders meeting he has cracked the whip like the harsh taskmaster he is. Get cracking mudpuppies the Bogg has spoken and if you don’t play your part as his minions he might repeat his passive agressive like missive about leaving you to your own devices.
Hurry up you don’t want to disapoint the Master he may be angered when he returns and you will suffer, oh you will suffer.
What if there is a real difference between the two, but they are just both really really bad?
Obama’s economic policies are destroying our First World status. His environmental policies are a joke. His health care reform was a half-course of antibiotics — enough to help some folks, but a lot of folks are also going to die.
Mitt Romney is unquestionably much worse. But ye gads, what did we do to deserve to be faced with this choice?
Obama ending DADT is the same as Hitler liking puppies, pretty much. Or, Kagan and Sotomayor is Mussolini getting the trains to run on time. Getting a start on national health care, Nixon starting the EPA. There we go: Obama=Nixon.
We didn’t do this to ourselves. It was done to us by a cutthroat upper class intimidating or taking ownership of the news media to leverage support from a sizable minority of dimwits — who regularly get off their asses and vote Republican. IMO.
So no bacon, then? WTF kind of bullshit committee is this, anyway?
And what if I could fly by inhaling unicorn farts?
I’m sure you’re just a Republican shill, as opposed to a sincere, well-meaning Nader voter (big difference), but it’s just tiring, because reason and logic have no room in the conversation.
Do you get extra points on comment threads for inciting vitriol? If so, I’m sorry for contributing, although it does do me proud to consider myself a “Job Creator.”
For tbogg, OT, but still and then some… Charlie Pierce has beaten you to the Tebow speculation this week.
I still think he should have landed with the Chargers, to ensure the end of the Norv Turner
erroreraOT, but Jesus Lawd, now they’re comparing their Senate candidates to megalomaniac suicidal cult leaders.
http://wonkette.com/485428/how-is-missouri-senate-candidate-todd-akin-setting-his-compound-on-fire-today#more-485428
This is, like, the best election evah!
No, Obama is a little to the right of Nixon, which makes him a screaming lefty to the news media.
This is a distraction, and we all know it. The important thing to concentrate on here is TBogg’s tone-deaf slur on all fecal-Americans. POWER TO THE POOPLE!
This is one good reason to stick with the black guy even if he is still sending drones over to africa.
Yes, some of teh gay will be helped by this and that is a good thing that will not happen under Rmoney / Ayn R
Also, too.
You bring the soul of Richard Nixon into the 21st Century and you get Dick Cheney.
Obama’s economic policies are destroying our First World status.
That’s OK, because most of the rest of the First World has even worse policies, although not as bad as Mitt’s. So we’ll all go down together, singing “Nearer My Dog To Thee”.
But, drones!
WHAT ABOUT MY CRYSTAL PURE CONSCIENCE?!?!
IRAQ AND AFGHANISTAN ARE NOT MY FAULT BECAUSE GORE WOULD’VE DONE IT TOO!
TBOGG’S BROKEN RECORD IS TIRED AND TIRESOME AND BUTTHURT BUT MY BROKEN RECORD IS ETERNALLY FASCINATING BECAUSE ME ME ME ME ME ME ME ME ME ME ME
I was about to embarrass myself by going all Quincy MD on that very assertion. My ranty – and (looking around for GWPDA) possibly dangerously ignorant treatise – was to start with discussion of our “First World” beginnings with our proudly imperialistic and unprovoked war against the dying Spanish Empire, leading eventually to our being the big economic power after WWII, largely by virtue of every other pre-war major nation being knocked flat on its back, giving rise to us feeing all exceptional and awesome-like (and for many of the religiously inclined, concluding that we are the Big Guy in the Sky’s Most Special Snowflake – with nukes).
But your clearly superior response saved me from myself.
I shall recommend to Basset HQ that from here on out, you be put in charge of addressing all comments featuring the theme ‘Halp! Obummer destroyin’ our 1st Worldiness!’
Why, we’ll be lucky if he is able to salvage its best features; the ACA is a long-overdue start. On the negative side, those Wall Street Giant Mutant Termites are still as powerful as ever…
If you really believe that, perhaps you should return to your coloring books rather than playing on the computer. Nixon had some redeeming qualities. He just had a persecution complex.
Cheney, with the possible exception of his acceptance of his lesbian daughter, is a full-on sociopath. You think Mr. “1% Doctrine” could go to China?
This comment sounds like another edition of “there’s no difference between the two”. Here on Blue Sky Earth, yes Virginia, there is quite a bit of difference. Hell even Reagan wasn’t as evil as Cheney. Richard Bruce is pretty much a class to himself, excepting hangers-on like Kristol and Krauthammer.
Obama’s economic policies are destroying our First World status.
Oh for Christ’s sake. Our “First World” status was primarily due to having an intact industrial base after WWII, when the rubble lay from London to the Causacus. Short of some serious economic protectionism, our “loss of First World” status is an inevitable result of the rest of the world becoming industrialized. Would I prefer that President Obama borrow $3 trillion at .001% interest to use for targeted response to this fact of life? Certainly. But there is no way in Hell he can do that with this Congress.
Most people seem to be bitching about the fact that Obama hasn’t given enough lip service to whatever their pet fetish is. Please, that’s the Republican way – tell people how lucky they are while you’re pissing on them. Screw that. Bill Clinton can give people warm fuzzies all day, but he has a lot more to do with our present economic condition than Barack Obama, thanks to his continuing the bank deregulation that Poppy started. Much more correct (though still naive) to say Bill Clinton cost us our First World status.
The reality is that the rest of the world is finally catching up to us. I’ve heard very little from anybody how best to handle the transition to service economy. That’s too grown-up for public discussion. But anybody telling you we can go back to the 1950′s (I’m looking at you, Willard) is absolutely 100% full of horseshit.
You just had to do this, didn’t you?
When you hear the knock on the door at 4 am, it will be the Fluffy Bunny Bund coming to get medieval on your ass.
Yeah, no shit. This is the most tiresome horse crap. One of these threads get going I read about 10 of ‘em and want to lock guys like punditus whaterverus in a room with some survivalists, teabaggers and some separatist evangelicals from Alaska for good measure. This must be another one of those 10% of cause 90%of things and we could set a match to all of them. I mean, find an adequate therapy to help them cope with reality.
Not to go too far off topic here, but you congratulate Charlie Pierce on his wonderful first year this week, and he turns around and starts pointing out the truth about Juice Box Jesus, aka Tim Tebow this afternoon.
Don’t you own that Franchise?
That’s OK, you were the first and in my opinion when it comes to the truth about “Mr. throws like a junior high girl”, you are still the best.
Go Niners!!!
He does until Pierce posts something more specifically vicious/graphically unforgiving than JuiceBox being serviced by The Press…
Here’s something amusing to speculate about; if the Republicans had been in charge at the end of WWII they would have fucked up our economy despite the advantage of having the only industrial base that hadn’t been bombed back into the stone age.
They wouldn’t have implemented (let alone have concieved of) the Marshal Plan. They would have insisted that the Europeans “boot-strap” themsleves out of the rubble and pay back the lend-lease money.
Leaving no money left in the world economy with which to buy all the bright and shiny goods being produced by those un-bombed American Factories. They would have been left, scratching their heads wondering what went wrong saying to each other, “I don’t get it, we’ve got the markets all sewn-up!”
Yeah, I mean I still like TBogg, but I liked his earlier, funny movies better.
Excellent points about post WW2 and Slick Willie LP. As to the the transition to the service economy that happened years ago and all those supposed high paying IT jobs never materalized or were outsourced because Mumbai could do them cheaper.
What we were left with are a few good paying positions and many low paying positions especially after the Dotcom bust.
Our fall to Third World status is assured since Capitalism has exploited all the easy consumables and is turning on it’s host, us.
Are you gonna stick your finger in that light socket anytime soon?
If not, could you please plug the reading lamp back in?
Oh, bull — fucking — shit!!!
As a Hippy/TrackTownUSA resident I blame Obama for “Obama blocks sale of Oregon wind farms to Chinese company”
A 22 year record
bombedshot to hell all because of teh drones….TBogg is getting quite boring with this stuff. It’s not like there’s a third party candidate out there that is a real threat to steal votes from Obama. He’s making the same point over and over again to whom? Grow up. A lot of people on the left are very disappointed with Obama and for good reason. Some of them are going to vote for him and some are not (for the record, I am probably going to vote for him, although I have very little “hope” for his second term). That was Obama’s strategy in the first place: Move as far to the right as possible, since you can genreally gain more votes than you lose that way. So now the fun idea here is to mock the relatively small percentage of voters on the left who are inevitably turned off enough by Obama’s pandering to vote for someone else or not vote at all. I get it, ha ha. Make jokes about Nader, etc. – YAWN. By TBogg’s logic, Obama should move even farther to the right and we should just continue to be good lemmings and vote for him unless he actually passes Romney on the right , in which case we should vote for Romney. Great. God Bless America and don’t worry about that nutcase holding up a Roadrunner cartoon bomb with a fuse at the UN.
Hopefully so boring that the tanbarks, Inappropriateresponses and Republican trolls lose interest….
Define troll.
The point of this post, among others I’ve done, is that the Romney campaign is in such disarray that the topic du jour among many is now “Looks like Obama is going to win this going away, so let’s try and fuck that up with navel-gazing and internal strife because winning makes us feel icky and guilty”.
The point of your post is quite obvious and is the same as the point of so many of your other posts for this election and the last and the one before that: To make fun of people who don’t want to vote for the Democratic candidate and mock them as hippies and idiots (with a great bounus graphic for those of us who need pictures to understand). I get the point. My point is that you are beating that point into the ground. Another comment from me on the subject would make me guilty of the same, so I’ll leave it at that.
Here’s a humble suggestion: Judge folks on their goals — the kind of society they want. Opinions about tactics will differ. What seems self-defeating and useless to you may seem like the only way to make progress to others who share your goals.
But YMMV.
You miss the point. In your own way, you’re every bit as out-of-touch as the fundy whackjobs. You are positing a politician that cannot exist in the real world. President Paul or President Stein could not do jack shit without a Congress having a similar worldview. That cannot obtain in present consensual reality. That’s just how it is. I don’t like it anymore than you do, but unlike you I realize that not liking it doesn’t change the reality.
You are offering your purity credentials. That’s all well and good, but here on Blue Sky Earth it’s still down and dirty, with vileness and pettyness you apparently cannot imagine. Anybody that didn’t realize that Barack Hussein Obama was always a milquetoast moderate was not paying attention. Yet, for the first time since Dale Bumpers ran for Governor (yep, I’m that old), I actually worked for the campaign in 2008, because I hoped, and could reasonably expect, Barack Obama to keep one promise: not to go to war with Iran. He kept that promise. That one point is enough to close the deal with me. There’s only two choices (and anyone who thinks otherwise is delusional), and only one of those doesn’t want to fight a country that makes Iraq look like the junior varsity.
You’re behind the times. My job got outsourced to Bangalore in 2003. I now find that a lot of the outsourcing is collapsing and work is moving back in house (I’m working in that situation right now).
Despite the belief (of idiot managers, but I repeat myself) that programming is fungible, it has become apparent that having a fucking clue about the specifics of a company or venture is essential to writing appropriately functional systems. Paying big bucks for guaranteed mediocre code (Accenture be thy name) is starting to fall out of favor.
It is not just the disarray in the Romoney campaign. It is the disarray in the mind of Mittens. A whole new dimension has been added to the campaign, clever chess player Obama versus mentally shaky Mitt. The whole world watches.
Annie was asked about her biggest worry if we had a MittBot for President.
Perhaps “to tanbark” will be wiki’d one day…
I very rarely hop out of the boat onto FDL Mothership Mainland anymore but did this morning.
My favorite from a very quick look-see? To paraphrase: Obama will see how many of us voted for 3rd party peeps and take notice.
Really?
you just know he loses sleep over that one.
I’m sixty-five, a voter all my life, and I’ve had it up to here with lesser evils.
I will no longer vote for anyone whom I do not wish to be president.
Does the remigration of these services have anything to do with depressed wages in the good old Homeland?
I’m not positiing anything. You are creating a fantasy version of what I posted. Did you even read it?
I like the enthusiasm! The honesty!
Where does political power come from?
The barrel of a gun.
But just keep squawking about electoral politics.
Yo. You forgot the Just Fucking With You Guys Now tag.
(shhhhhhhhhh……)
(jebuz dave, you’re gonna cut off the funtime….)
We’ll have to revisit your misunderstanding of Obama’s intentions for Iran after the Selection or should i say the people who pull his strings intentions.
Your are well informed about Iran not being the pushover some think it would be, the Fifth Fleet war ganes a few years ago were a disaster for the Blue Team so they dumped the Red Team commander and altered the parameters for a better outcome.
I was about to say the same thing. This whole subject grows more tedious by the minute…sad, really.
See? I told you so, goddamnit…between provoking the trolls and those for whom no candidate can be sufficiently pure, you done fucked up the whole evening. I require a serious dose of Shakira to remove the bad taste from my mouth, and have to go seek her. Desperately.
Oh I was kidding.
Well I mean I pretty much skip these threads also but if the patron has fun baiting those whose greater blogopatronage he’s embedded, er in (diagram that sentence) (somebody, please, diagram that sentence) (my sentence is so fat, that…) then you know, what the heck.
Your are well informed about Iran not being the pushover some think it would be, the Fifth Fleet war ganes a few years ago were a disaster for the Blue Team so they dumped the Red Team commander and altered the parameters for a better outcome.
English, motherfucker, DO YOU SPEAK IT?
Right you are. Added.
See above.
Hell, the Republicans didn’t want us to enter World War II because they were cutting side deals with Hitler. They (with German help) were funding and running the isolationist movement, and the only reason they started to back off was when Charles Lindbergh came back from his Potemkin tour of Germany and made an ass of himself talking about the Nazis’ unstoppable military machine when everyone in the Pentagon knew that the Wehrmacht still relied on horses for most of their supply lines. (Something that shocks the folks who get all their WWII knowledge from watching movies.)
He’s referring to how the Bushies in the Pentagon (yeah, Paul Wolfowitz and Doug Feith and your pet brasses, I’m looking at YOU) sabotaged the Millenium Challenge war games when Marine General Paul Van Riper, playing the “Red Team” (aka Iraqi) commander, was beating the snot out of the invading US Fleet until the neocons did a game reset:
Thanks for that PW, and especially for the link to an article I found to be informed, informative, and pretty damned entertaining, considering the fact it’s written by a guy who spends a lot of time contemplating war scenarios.
I’m surprised to discover that it was so, from his first lines:
When kids play war, they end up spending less time shooting than arguing: “You’re dead!” “Am not! You missed!” It just gets worse the bigger the kids. I remember a D & D’er crying when his character got killed — wouldn’t talk to the rest of us for years, still grieving for his dead elf.
And onward, into the world of old money, old contractors, old navy (not the clothing chain) and old thinking.
Highly recommended.
My apologies, Wayoutwest, for the frustrated Pulp Fiction remonstrance, which tone I blame on repeated viewing of Sam Jackson’s Wake The Fuck Up video recently, hee hee.
I have a question for the gimlet-eyed Metternichs here, as they break out the scales to weigh the cost-benefit balance of Obama’s policies; does one quantify/weight the dead innocents from the oh-so-boring drones and where’s the line?
An apology on tbogg’s site? I guess there is still hope for the human race.
Can you point to the comment(s) where people have done that kind of analysis on the drone attacks themselves? In my reading of the comments, it is usually on the issue of whether the other candidate(s) would either do even worse (Romney), or would never be able to achieve office in the first place (Stein, Johnson, etc.), or if by some miracle achieves office, would have free agency in such matters. And of course, that is just on one issue; there are a bunch of other issues that many feel are of equal or greater urgency.
On the Metternich thing:
Prince Klemens Wenzel von Metternich (15 May 1773 – 11 June 1859): …one of the most important diplomats of his era, …Foreign Minister of the Holy Roman Empire and its successor state, the Austrian Empire (1809-1848), …engineered Austria’s entry into the War of the Sixth Coalition, …signed the Treaty of Fontainebleau, …eventually casted aside in 1848 – but up until then, what a glorious ride!
Commenter on TBogg site: …someone likely using a pseudonym to read blogs, …appreciates some laughs with her/his politics, …probably has the right to vote (state government permitting), but possessing approximately zero national-level power/influence beyond that …can maybe sway an opinion or two around the water cooler at work, maybe does some volunteering/canvassing/committee work locally (yay!) …rants at computer/TV screen or radio at some outrage, realizing that s/he can’t do a damned thing about the matter, until spouse tells her/him to knock it off, …if living the best kind of life, is making whatever kind of difference s/he can where that is possible – at local level (home, work, community), …but at national level? See the gazillion comments here (and elsewhere) that address the myriad manifestations of this latter question.
Since you ask, I’ll speak for Obama here. The idea is to minimize the costs, yes, fucking bloody obviously, you dumbass. That’s part of the reason for using drones in the first place, because the collateral damage is minimized. You may contrast this with the carpet bombing policies of Dubya (it was called “shock and awe,” remember?).
Now you might say, well, how about we just don’t engage at all, which is certainly an option, but I’ve got news for you. That will do nothing to halt terrorism, and it’ll only grow. I promise you, a drone strike isn’t a terrorism recruiting tool, because most can see the sense of it. A senseless invasion and genocide is such a tool and we’re eating the results of Dubya, that stupid and cruel monster, and his decisions now, and will be for years.
So thanks again Ralph.
Sometimes I wonder at the selective nature of these complaints. Consider that police forces in America kill people sometimes, and sometimes there is collateral damage, and no one suggests disbanding police forces as a solution– we just strive to have better police forces and methods.
The recent addition of the taser to the policeman’s arsenal would be welcome, you’d think, as a less lethal alternative to a handgun, but there are nevertheless cases where its use is condemned, sometimes fairly, sometimes not. But the solution in any case is better cops and methodology, and it’s only a fringe that suggests its use be outlawed altogether.
The same fringe that condemns drone strikes, I think.
In the meantime, I think Obama appreciates the wisdom of not poking a stick into a hornet’s nest, but still has to deal with a very real threat of terrorism both at home and abroad, and is doing his best to do so, something the previous president completely fucking failed at. But there is a very real threat, and it needs to be dealt with. Wake The Fuck Up, in other words.
There are beasties out there that would do you harm, so I’ll sing you no lullaby.
–Ian Anderson, No Lullaby
As an aside, I suspect some of the trepidation over drones is because of the sexy-sounding nomenclature itself, which I think for some suggests killer robots from a Terminator movie, although the truth is that it’s essentially not much more than a larger and more sophisticated version of the RC airplanes hobbyists so enjoy flying around.
This being my first foray on this or any FDL forum I don’t know if you are a Smug Dick Lieutenant here or not but oh the authority with which you proclaim: The “collateral damage” is minimized, the terrorists aren’t recruited, you define the fringe and the obvious. Come on, tough guy, give us a metric, an acceptable number of bodies and please speak only for yourself.
And yes, I do find weighing in on this War Room(Lite) circle jerk useless.
Come on, tough guy, give us a metric, an acceptable number of bodies and please speak only for yourself.
Nobody realistically could, and you know it, so why the bullshit?
Of course, if you set the number at zero, as you apparently do, that makes it easier for you; you can stop thinking about it, and move on to more important considerations like butterflies, kittens and rainbows. And that’s the beauty of absolutism isn’t it? It’s not realistic, but hey, thinking is work for you, obviously, and accepting that there are no perfect solutions and there will be sad consequences is so very very distressing for you, snowflake, is it not?
And by the way, tough guy, you’re the one posting under a pseudonym, not me.
We’re all Smug Dick Lieutenants here, even you, at least on Saturdays. Sundays we’re part of the JuiceBox Jesus Throws A Tight Spiral Drum Circle, always hoping, always let down. If you’re worried about collateral damage it’s a goddamn good think Tebow isn’t let near a drone joystick…
Just what IS a ‘Smug Dick Lieutenant’ anyway? I just can’t keep up with what the kids are saying these days, what with their hippety-hop music and tattoos and Prince-Albert-in-a-can body ornaments…
And syrpha, I suspect that Chris @72 is right about you, but who knows? Maybe you have proved TBogg wrong, and in fact you DO live there, in that place. (If you do, can you take me with you when you go home? That place sounds nice.)
I have problems with the drones, although much of it borne of ignorance – I’m not a pacifist, so I’m not absolutely opposed to their use, but I just don’t know how justified their use is on a case-by-case basis.
And in general, as far as your (apparent) zero tolerance policy on deaths of foreign innocents, well, good luck with that. Perhaps you could provide some historical examples of past U.S. governments where that has worked out; I’m coming up blank here. Your zero tolerance policy is reminiscent of much of the pro-life crowd, but at least you’re talking about viable fully-born actual people as victims, so you have that going for you, I suppose.
Hell, I remain surprised at my ignorant and craven fellow citizens for not supporting the closing of Guantanamo, since our domestic prison Federal prison system has a pretty good record on not losing people (guilt-vs-innocence of Guantanamo prisoners, as well as proper treatment of prisoners in the U.S. penal system, are worthwhile but entirely separate discussions). I think Obummer and Eric Holder must have been surprised too, when they tried moving those prisoners to the U.S., only to have an overwhelming, veto-proof majority of Congress nix that. Losses like that can translate into perceptions of political weakness, affecting other initiatives, and the Kenyan Usurpur surely knows that. Lesson learned (sadly).
There is no evidence that Americans are anymore clued in, or care about, the drones. I think the White House has received that message loud and clear. Like the Guantanamo issue, this issue needs grassroots efforts; the White House will not take any major political hits over a policy when there isn’t a majority or sizable minority in their corner. Syrpha, I hope you are doing what you can to raise awareness on this issue among the citizenry in your area. It’s certainly not unimportant – the choice to kill others never is – but among viable candidates, I’ll take the guy who appears to be thoughtful and maybe persuadable on this issue any day, over the non-empathetic privileged prince of vulture capitalism who seems to think that attacking Iran might just be a ducky idea.
Two questions for you meepmeep09:
1) can we not send a well-trained battalion to hug the violence out of the mean people?
2) wouldn’t Romney outsource the drone-control to the lowest bidder?
(p.s. can I maybe take your @74 intelligent-yet-frisky comment out on a movie date sometime?)
Answers:
#1 – Interesting idea. Being of a certain age, I seem to recall something like this being tried once by John Lennon (RIP/PBUH) and Yoko Ono on The Mike Douglas Show way back when, where John and Yoko randomly cold-called people from the set and said (IIRC) “I Love You” to the courteous but undoubtedly bewildered people at the other end of the line. I don’t know if anything ever resulted from that exercise, although I suspect some folks got unlisted phone numbers after that. [Tried to find YouTube evidence of that, but no success.]
#2 – Of course he would outsource it, although it wouldn’t be to the lowest bidder, but to the bestest bidder, as in a team player who would spread around the goodies to all the right people; Bain management principles, baybee! I’m envisioning Eric Prince of Blackwater/Xe/whatever, back in the saddle again, just like old times!
As to the p.s., comment #74 is well known as a total slut, and will jump into your arms in response to just a smile. I recommend you take along “protection” on your date.
Oh, and to return for a moment to the discussion of drones and our foreign policy, here’s Jamie Bouie on the subject. He’s a whole lot harsher on Obama than most of us “Obamabots” here, but he still comes down on the side of him being the best viable choice for the office.
Yeah, humanity sucks.
Thanks for letting me date your comment.
When you say “slutty” and “arms” and “protection” are you suggesting I use those shoulder-length exam gloves Mrs Willard sent over? Her note said something about “you people” can keep your unicorn’s horn warm with these…
Ooh, kinky! #74 likes it that way.
You kids have fun, and stay out of the police blotter.
If for nothing else, know that Chester Gould has rolled in his grave, and would have given anything to have given his Dick Tracy an angry and implacable superior officer:
Lieutenant Smugdick.
It’s a perfect fit, don’t you think?
Obama campaigned as someone who push back against the civil liberties abuses of the Bush era. As president, he has doubled-down on them. The drone war in Pakistan, expanded by the Obama administration, has claimed hundreds of innocent lives, and is conducted under a veil of secrecy.
I’m afraid I stop read after this.
And incidentally, how do you find shit like this?
I mean, really, [laughing] do you fire up the computer first thing in the morning and google “Obama Bad” or something?
“Our “First World” status was primarily due to having an intact industrial base after WWII, ”
I thought it was due to building that industry up in the first place. Silly me.
If you look at the graphic inserted at the top of this post, you’ll see that TBogg’s new internet pal provided that link with a hearty thumbs-up (a commenter in Cole’s post supplied the actual link to Bouie’s article).
Though I admire his overall viewpoint, I’m not a fan of how Greenwald sometimes goes about making his case – think throwing chaff in the courtroom in lieu of adequate supporting evidence – so I was suspicious of the link. Also, Bouie didn’t really show his work with his assertions about Obama’s foreign policy promises in the 2008 campaign, but working as he does for CAP, he also has something of an agenda. And why he is kissing Friedersdorf’s ass is a mystery to me; probably one young Washington policy wonk’s back washing the other’s (that happens). I thought Syrpha might find it educational and somewhat to her liking, since she was asking about this sort of thing (I’m presuming sincerity on her part).
For myself, I’m with Tim F. over at Cole’s place, who said that Conor F. is basically trolling the internet (mostly lefties), and told the other front-pagers at B-J who were linking CF’s piece the following:
I was concentrating on Congressional races in 2008, and despite the media noise bleed-over from the Presidential campaign, I didn’t hear in real time what BHO was promising at the time in the way of foreign policy, beyond easing us out of Iraq and increasing (at least momentarily) our efforts in AfPak. He’s done both, and been a very good President overall – certainly the best we could have hoped for, given what he inherited, and what/who he has to work with – but I don’t ever get all starry-eyed about what he and others in that office do. I see enough of that realm of darkness, fog, and shadows to believe that any occupant of the WH can survive there without getting his/her hands dirty, or not being everything that s/he promised in the election.
Thanks for filling that out a bit, Meep, and greetings from Hollywood. Making movie magic is all about the kluge, the workaround, the compromise, just so long as you get the damn shot, so I’m no stranger to not being able to do everything I want, exactly the way I want.
May be part of the reason I see Obama’s dilemma for what it is, and still perceive him to be doing good work. As you say, he is playing the cards he was dealt, and I wonder if Hillary doesn’t sigh in relief sometimes, because this has got to be the most thankless presidency ever.
Ha, validation! I haven’t gone completely senile yet!
Yoko and John making I-Love-You cold calls from The Mike Douglas Show in 1972 (10:04).